Topic ID 2094
With the application by Serendipity to change the use for the outlet next door refused I have wondered what would have happened if Caffe Nero had just moved in there, changed the building and applied for change of use retrospectively. Are the planning department more up for the fight when their opponent is only small?
Reply ID 28057
What a scurrilous allegation! No, on second thoughts you are probably right... [:)]
Reply ID 28094
I would like to think that you are wrong - but it does appear to be the case. An extended serendipity would be an asset to the town, and it is also the type of outlet that brings people into the town during the daytime. [:(!] at the planning department.
Reply ID 28143
So reading the decision here [url="http://e-services.eastherts.gov.uk/swiftlg/apas/run/WPHAPPDETAIL.DisplayUrl?theApnID=3/06/1615/FP&theTabNo=2&backURL=%3Ca%20href=wphappcriteria.display?paSearchKey=20338%3ESearch%20Criteria%3C/a%3E%20%3E%20%3Ca%20href=%20wphappsearchres.displayResultsURL?ResultID=38749%26StartIndex=1%26SortOrder=APNID:asc%26DispResultsAs=WPHAPPSEARCHRES%26BackURL=%3Ca%20href=wphappcriteria.display?paSearchKey=20338%3ESearch%20Criteria%3C/a%3E%20%3ESearch%20Results%3C/a%3E"]Link to Planning Website[/url] It appears that the planning policy in the town is that it is preferable to have an empty shop because it has "prime retail" potential rather than let a sucessful business expand because it is a cafe.
Reply ID 28185
quote:Exactly. A thriving, proven local independent business looking to expand into the empty premises next door is denied the opportunity. Yet Caffe Nero were allowed to get away with changing use of premises, altering a listed building and applying for approval retrospectively. I understand the need to protect the viability of Bircherley Green as a retail centre by ensuring the correct mix of retailers business types but the decision seems a bit unfair in light of the capitulation in the Caffe Nero case.
Originally posted by jez_p
So reading the decision here [url="http://e-services.eastherts.gov.uk/swiftlg/apas/run/WPHAPPDETAIL.DisplayUrl?theApnID=3/06/1615/FP&theTabNo=2&backURL=%3Ca%20href=wphappcriteria.display?paSearchKey=20338%3ESearch%20Criteria%3C/a%3E%20%3E%20%3Ca%20href=%20wphappsearchres.displayResultsURL?ResultID=38749%26StartIndex=1%26SortOrder=APNID:asc%26DispResultsAs=WPHAPPSEARCHRES%26BackURL=%3Ca%20href=wphappcriteria.display?paSearchKey=20338%3ESearch%20Criteria%3C/a%3E%20%3ESearch%20Results%3C/a%3E"]Link to Planning Website[/url] It appears that the planning policy in the town is that it is preferable to have an empty shop because it has "prime retail" potential rather than let a sucessful business expand because it is a cafe.
Reply ID 28187
I think Serendipity should just open up, and apply again retrospectively! That will put the cat amongst the pigeons!
Reply ID 28189
quote:Caffe Nero have the financial resources to fight the council through a prolonged legal process. Even if they lost they could cope with being forced to close down a branch. I doubt if Serendipity are in the same position.
Originally posted by Dude
I think Serendipity should just open up, and apply again retrospectively! That will put the cat amongst the pigeons!
Reply ID 28200
Just been for my customary coffee and Serendipity now have a petition on their counter for squashed-in customers to sign which will presumably be presented to the Planners
Reply ID 28203
I am sure that if Serendipity had the means to apply retrospectively for planning permission then they would. The process by which caffe nero obtained their permission was ultimately legitimate and the area is much improved by their addition. I wish people would stop complaining about Caffe Nero. Perhaps one of those nice reporters at the Mercury could join the campaign to let serendiptiy expand.
Reply ID 28208
The problem with Caffe Nero is that despite their own Local Plan which exist(ed) to protect the retail sector in certain designated parts of town, the officer found a handful of paragraphs in Government planning guidelines that allowed them to drive a coach and horses through their own Local Plan. Having created a precedent i find it hard to understand how they can apply one set of rules to one application and another to one that for all appearances is similar. It is not that Caffe Nero appeared in town it was the way they went about it. Persoanlly I found the natural wood exterior more pleasing than the new tint of lilac - but planning rules have to be enforced. Despite this I am not too sure if the first floor extractor fan has been moved or the adjoining door into number 8 been suitable re-plastered. If anyone would like to join me this weekend i am off on a treasure hunt to find the hidden location for the £15,000 offer for street furniture. My defintion and Highways definition differs quite radically from the interpretation offered by East Herts but I would like to know where the money has gone. If it ever existed. If i could go up, up and away in my beaufiful balloon I might find a very large 'X' marking the spot.
Reply ID 28474
Hey sloop, can I come up in your balloon with ya? quite fancy seeing Hertford in all it's glory! However this seems to have turned into a Serendipity versus Nero's issue & it shouldn't be,I hear from a quite reliable source that Nero opening up has not ever affected Serendipity's trade as to be honest although they are both coffee shops, one is an independant place who can make exactly what food you want infront of you & the other has it made in some unknown venue by some unknown person then delivered to them at god knows when in the morning. You can buy a pre packaged sandwich anywhere in town, petrol stations, whatever. Just seems a shame that the team at Serendipity have worked their b*ll*cks off to create a great reputation & only need the shop next door to fit in the customers that want to come to them & improve facilities/service, but have been denied on the fact that Chay Dempster of East Herts planning says so. No comittee, no oppourtunity to express views, just a bloke in an office who hasn't even bothered to come & see how many people actually go there, has a direct effect on peoples lives & livelihood. Shame on Chay. Still I hear the Serendipity petition has now reached 300 & still going strong with a Mercury article on fri, who knows? maybe Hertford people power will overcome, lets hope so.
Reply ID 28479
As sure as Monday follows Sunday the Mercury rang me regarding the Serendipity petition. Something that I am aware of but don't have full knowledge of is that certain planning applications can be decided by a Planning Officer rather than everything going to committe. My only real opposition to Caffe Nero was that their way of doing things in Hertford was exactly the same as they had done all over the UK. Buy, develop, open - and no local council has stood in their way. It is an addition to the town, it looks quite smart, is popular and rather regrettably had to change the wooden framework - but if Serendipity had done the same thing to Going Places and offered £15,000 for street furniture (possibly new signage to East Herts Leisure centres) would they have got their pwermission. Alas, we will never know. I am not too sure how my comments will look on Friday having covered just about every aspect of this but if the Mercury are willing to sponsor a balloon then Maddy, I will fly you to the moon if necessary.
Reply ID 28494
This sounds like another example of "Because it is the rules" debate. Perhaps these people should start a council department to ensure that all the taxi drivers parking in Green Street have their bale of hay in the boot - because it is the law! Or perhaps we should all go on a jolly to Chester and shoot welsh people with bows and arrows. Rules are generally made for a reason, but if the reasons are forgotten superceded or whatever then the rules become stupid.
Reply ID 28499
quote:Well, in that case, get the rules changed! Otherwise, where do you draw the line? Is it OK to do 60mph in a 30mph limit simply because you think the "rules" are outdated? Or to perhaps mug someone because the "rules" are stupid?
Originally posted by jez_p
This sounds like another example of "Because it is the rules" debate. Perhaps these people should start a council department to ensure that all the taxi drivers parking in Green Street have their bale of hay in the boot - because it is the law! Or perhaps we should all go on a jolly to Chester and shoot welsh people with bows and arrows. Rules are generally made for a reason, but if the reasons are forgotten superceded or whatever then the rules become stupid.
Reply ID 28664
Went in for the first time in a while and made a point of signing the petition. It is now close to 500! Good show. I was also reminded that the Coffee is fully leaded![:D]
Reply ID 30099
quote:Something looking like a re-furb was happening today. Did Serendipity get it in the end (the business they seem to do it would be an asset to all) or do we have any ideas what it is going to be?
Originally posted by Scouter
Went in for the first time in a while and made a point of signing the petition. It is now close to 500! Good show. I was also reminded that the Coffee is fully leaded![:D]