Topic ID 2863
I have lived and grown up in Hertford my whole life (23 years) and am now have to move out as I can not afford to buy a reasonable property in my home town! I have been renting a flat here for the last 2 years and am now looking forward to having a property of my own, yet I can not buy a simple little two bedroom house in the area which I find to be a really kick in the teeth! I have paid my far share of council tax, I have worked for local businesses and consider myself to be a very loyal member of the community and now I have been forced to leave! This I find very upsetting to be honest and I do not see why, as a hard working member of my local community, I am expected to either pay up or get out when people on the local council housing list are given brand new, riverside apartments for peanuts! (Please be aware that I am not referring to people in need of housing more to people who are social spongers and I personally know people in this situation to who I am referring). I think this is a very sad situation indeed and I hope for the sake of all the young people in the town that things change by the time they are old enough to become home owners.
Reply ID 41413
quote:Very sad. Where are you off to?
Originally posted by bec501uk
I have lived and grown up in Hertford my whole life (23 years) and am now have to move out as I can not afford to buy a reasonable property in my home town! I have been renting a flat here for the last 2 years and am now looking forward to having a property of my own, yet I can not buy a simple little two bedroom house in the area which I find to be a really kick in the teeth! I have paid my far share of council tax, I have worked for local businesses and consider myself to be a very loyal member of the community and now I have been forced to leave! This I find very upsetting to be honest and I do not see why, as a hard working member of my local community, I am expected to either pay up or get out when people on the local council housing list are given brand new, riverside apartments for peanuts! (Please be aware that I am not referring to people in need of housing more to people who are social spongers and I personally know people in this situation to who I am referring). I think this is a very sad situation indeed and I hope for the sake of all the young people in the town that things change by the time they are old enough to become home owners.
Reply ID 41415
Beck, I can really understand your frustration. It seems the harder you work the less respect you get from the 'authorities' After 20 odd years working we sold 2 propities, one Ware and one Hertford to buy the house we wanted and be able to make the changes we want to, and it's not massive. It is a real shame that people that love the Town are being driven out. Commuter belt and all that stuff I suppose. Best of luck and hopefully you will be able to come back soon. [:(]
Reply ID 41416
I think there was a time when Hertford was viewed by Londoners as just 'the sticks', as a realtive once called it. Now it is desirable.
Reply ID 41419
I sympathise bec. Hertford is basicaly divided into two. Those who already own property and those who are never likely to. Property here rises faster than wages, keeping it always just out of reach.
Reply ID 41420
I think Bec's main grudge is against the system that allows 'spongers' (her word) to have handed on plate what she, despite working hard and paying taxes, cannot afford. I can onlyh sympathise with her. This government has a lot to answer for by making the average worker worse off than the scrounger.
Reply ID 41426
I see that a property in Bengeo Street is going for £500,000.00 - semidetached! what is it coming to half a million of a 3 bed (small rooms) house!!!! they were originally asking £525,000.00
Reply ID 41429
Unfortunately Hertford is the victim of market forces. Continual Urban sprawl from London coupled with lack of property supply have created a sellers market, thus inflated prices. The estate agents have also cottoned onto the American concept of 'open days' which only inflate the prices even more. Until we become a communist state, there is nothing really we can do about this.
Reply ID 41430
According to the media, someone in the Government has finally woken up to the fact that it's not loads of high density housing that's needed to get people on the property ladder, but a number of family size semi-detached and detached homes so that everyone can shuffle up the ladder and free up some smaller stock for first time buyers. I know from talking to other Hertford families that there is a shortage of family homes in Hertford - that's why modest houses (such as the one on Bengeo Street Furrybunny mentions) are fetching crazy prices around here. Not helped by the criminal stamp duty we have to pay. The problem with building bigger homes is that they require more land, which means nibbling away at greenbelt as just about every brownfield site around here has had high density housing built on it.
Reply ID 41436
Back in 1994, me and my wife decided to settle in Hertford because it was the nearest (nice!) place to Enfield (where we both worked at the time) where we could afford to get a house. We bought a brand-new 2 bed terraced house on Foxholes for the princely sum of £63000. I believe someone opposite that house sold their similar property last year/early this year for something like £210000. Absolutely ridiculous! I dread to think how my three kids will ever manage to get their own places when they're grown up (currently the eldest is 11) but I certainly sympathise with bec501uk.
Reply ID 41437
it's certainly concerning. a 1 bed flat came on today on the edge of hertford for 153k. madness! has a garden which i guess is unique for a flat, but that means u need to be on 35-40k to afford it!
Reply ID 41439
Unfortunately it's not just Hertford that is showing ridiculous house price growth. I originally come from a small town in Norfolk. 10/12 years ago you could buy a nice house there for less than 40k - now they go for over 250k! I think with all the news recently about inflation on the up and interest rise hikes on the horizon, it seems inevitable that prices must come down. Bec - you may well be able to afford to buy here in a couple of years or so if you can hold on...
Reply ID 41441
quote:On what do you base this? Though the propagaganda of television campaigns are designed to make us believe that, when you really examine the facts, it just isn't so. Can you live on £84 a fortnight? That's what a single unemployed person gets, not always on time, and with the constant need for them to prove entitlement. Unless you have a home, you get nothing (that's why there are beggars). You will not be offered a home, unless you have income and then you'll probably be expected to sleep on the street for at least a year beforehand. Disability benefit is even harder, SSP is dependent on contributions. Absolutely nothing, nothing at all is "handed on a plate". The government spends huge amounts of your money on making you believe there are "scroungers" and getting you angry. It designed to distract you from seeing the real suffering that they are ignoring.
Originally posted by maggie
I think Bec's main grudge is against the system that allows 'spongers' (her word) to have handed on plate what she, despite working hard and paying taxes, cannot afford. I can onlyh sympathise with her. This government has a lot to answer for by making the average worker worse off than the scrounger.
Reply ID 41445
I too sympathise.. I am not a homeowner and feel I may never be,not just because of three redundancies since June 2000 to stomach but that at the time my friends were getting their way on the property ladder it was with the then boyfriend/fiance etc.. if you are trying to do it on your own.. forget it! Its not just here the whole country seems to be hellbent of "bigging up" the value of properties for what??? to talk about it and say "my house is worth £2,500K more than last month"! Big deal.. the banks will not loan people unlimited amounts of money to buy a property if they know it will never be paid back, so sometime maybe soon, its going to hit everyone in the eye. I feel that its a right for everyone to have a shelter.. I never wanted much, just a modest one or two bedroom property... but I don't think I could even buy one in Cardiff let alone the town I was born in... Its not right and very soon its going to be a problem...
Reply ID 41446
quote:Quite easily when you consider that as Bec says in her own words that she knows personally of "spongers" who have been given riverside apartments to live in. Lets assume these riverside apartments are similar to the Riviere development. They go for around 250k. An interest only mortgage on 250k would cost around 1k per month (an estimate). That together with no council tax to pay plus other benefits such as free dental care plus the £84 per week you mention probably add up to at least what the average wage earner takes home after tax in a month. Therefore, given that these people don't actually have to get up and go to work every day, means that they are both financially AND physically better off. Add into the equation a little bit of cash in hand work that may be available - aren't they laughing at all of us like Bec who works hard, pays tax and cannot afford what they have been 'handed on a plate'?
Originally posted by shuntquote:On what do you base this? Though the propagaganda of television campaigns are designed to make us believe that, when you really examine the facts, it just isn't so. Can you live on £84 a fortnight? That's what a single unemployed person gets, not always on time, and with the constant need for them to prove entitlement. Unless you have a home, you get nothing (that's why there are beggars). You will not be offered a home, unless you have income and then you'll probably be expected to sleep on the street for at least a year beforehand. Disability benefit is even harder, SSP is dependent on contributions. Absolutely nothing, nothing at all is "handed on a plate". The government spends huge amounts of your money on making you believe there are "scroungers" and getting you angry. It designed to distract you from seeing the real suffering that they are ignoring.
Originally posted by maggie
I think Bec's main grudge is against the system that allows 'spongers' (her word) to have handed on plate what she, despite working hard and paying taxes, cannot afford. I can onlyh sympathise with her. This government has a lot to answer for by making the average worker worse off than the scrounger.
Reply ID 41448
Since my nephew's teenage girlfriend produced a babby, they have moved into a flat in Toothbrush Towers. Neither of them work, yet they run a car and have all the latest baby gear. As far as I know, they havn't come by this dishonestly and both of them come from poor backgrounds. If the Government isn't paying for all this, I wonder who is?
Reply ID 41449
quote:Maggie, I personally feel you will be waiting a long time for prices to come down significantly. Banks are finding innovative ways of making mortgages affordable (in some cases 7+ times the annual salary, interest only). However, if the bubble does burst, keep a look-out for all the Estate agent leaflets coming through the door wanting you to sell your property!
Originally posted by maggie
Unfortunately it's not just Hertford that is showing ridiculous house price growth. I originally come from a small town in Norfolk. 10/12 years ago you could buy a nice house there for less than 40k - now they go for over 250k! I think with all the news recently about inflation on the up and interest rise hikes on the horizon, it seems inevitable that prices must come down. Bec - you may well be able to afford to buy here in a couple of years or so if you can hold on...
Reply ID 41450
quote:What's your point Nora?
Originally posted by nora batty
Since my nephew's teenage girlfriend produced a babby, they have moved into a flat in Toothbrush Towers. Neither of them work, yet they run a car and have all the latest baby gear. As far as I know, they havn't come by this dishonestly and both of them come from poor backgrounds. If the Government isn't paying for all this, I wonder who is?
Reply ID 41451
quote:Buying while single is tough. Even worse, the are still many women out there who see home ownership as the principle qualification a potential mate! Divorce is a total restart too. How can a man morally take a legal share of the house, when that would leave his ex and children with insufficient funds to re-purchase. Hence, there are many who had to start all over, leaving every asset behind. It's getting back to the days when relationships were made for financial reasons.
Originally posted by Drama Queen
I too sympathise.. I am not a homeowner and feel I may never be,not just because of three redundancies since June 2000 to stomach but that at the time my friends were getting their way on the property ladder it was with the then boyfriend/fiance etc.. if you are trying to do it on your own.. forget it! Its not just here the whole country seems to be hellbent of "bigging up" the value of properties for what??? to talk about it and say "my house is worth £2,500K more than last month"! Big deal.. the banks will not loan people unlimited amounts of money to buy a property if they know it will never be paid back, so sometime maybe soon, its going to hit everyone in the eye. I feel that its a right for everyone to have a shelter.. I never wanted much, just a modest one or two bedroom property... but I don't think I could even buy one in Cardiff let alone the town I was born in... Its not right and very soon its going to be a problem...
Reply ID 41452
Hasnt it always been the case that people have moved further out to get on the property ladder ? My Grandparents always talked about how they had to leave Clerkenwell for the 'country' town of Tottenham , my parents left Tottenham for Hoddesdon , i set up home in Hertford and my daughter is now starting off in Stevenage . Leaving the town of your upbringing is not a new thing , but the norm i would say .
Reply ID 41454
quote:Sorry Azzza, it was in response to the above posts. If the Government is not handing out money, I am wondering how my nephew, his girlfriend and baby are surviving so well?
Originally posted by shuntquote:On what do you base this? Though the propagaganda of television campaigns are designed to make us believe that, when you really examine the facts, it just isn't so. Can you live on £84 a fortnight? That's what a single unemployed person gets, not always on time, and with the constant need for them to prove entitlement. Unless you have a home, you get nothing (that's why there are beggars). You will not be offered a home, unless you have income and then you'll probably be expected to sleep on the street for at least a year beforehand. Disability benefit is even harder, SSP is dependent on contributions. Absolutely nothing, nothing at all is "handed on a plate". The government spends huge amounts of your money on making you believe there are "scroungers" and getting you angry. It designed to distract you from seeing the real suffering that they are ignoring.
Originally posted by maggie
I think Bec's main grudge is against the system that allows 'spongers' (her word) to have handed on plate what she, despite working hard and paying taxes, cannot afford. I can onlyh sympathise with her. This government has a lot to answer for by making the average worker worse off than the scrounger.
Reply ID 41455
it's true, it's always been tough to buy your first house. In fact, it _shouldnt_ be easy! I think there's a degree of psychological pricing barriers too, people forget salaries have risen, and assume that a 100k house was just as affordable 10 yrs ago as it would be if one was available now.
Reply ID 41457
[/quote] Quite easily when you consider that as Bec says in her own words that she knows personally of "spongers" who have been given riverside apartments to live in. Lets assume these riverside apartments are similar to the Riviere development. They go for around 250k. An interest only mortgage on 250k would cost around 1k per month (an estimate). That together with no council tax to pay plus other benefits such as free dental care plus the £84 per week you mention probably add up to at least what the average wage earner takes home after tax in a month. Therefore, given that these people don't actually have to get up and go to work every day, means that they are both financially AND physically better off. Add into the equation a little bit of cash in hand work that may be available - aren't they laughing at all of us like Bec who works hard, pays tax and cannot afford what they have been 'handed on a plate'? [/quote] It's £84 a fortnight and the other benefits you mention are rarely available and only available whilst at £84 a fortnight and then only if there are children. Any in increase one might add is deducted from the whole, hence, however hard you work, it's always £42 per week. It's hard to escape this system, since the only way to do so is fraud and the vast majority are either not criminal or not clever or able enough to do it. If they were, they wouldn't be there in the first place. More is spent on convincing you that there is widespread fraud than is taken by fraudsters. Housing is only provided to those genuinely on the street or to protect children and then usually after a long delay. My son was born in a hostel, whilst I was left to live rough, forbidden to be with my wife after 10.30pm, despite her impending labour. I was desperately trying to hold down a job, appear smart and clean, hiding my true sitution from my employers. I may be affluent now, but I never forget where I came from and one thing I'm sure of is that so called "scroungers" are a scapegoat.
Reply ID 41461
I don't really understand what the problem is here. I lived in Enfield for all of my childhood and when the time came to buy my own place I knew damn well that I couldn't afford anything in any of the parts of Enfield that I would want to live. Therefore my only affordable option was a studio flat in Cheshunt which was a pain when it came to seeing family and friends but was a good start on the 'property ladder'. I didn't feel put out that I couldn't afford to live on my own in my place of birth, it was just one of those things. It was only when I met Mrs Leaky that we pooled our funds and could afford a place in Hertford (which was always my place of choice). Even now with two full time incomes we 'only' have a two bedroom cottage so feeling some sort of natural right to start out with a two bedroom house seems a touch ambitious to me.
Reply ID 41462
quote:Shunt - whilst the story of your Oliver Twist like backgound is endearing, that is not what we are talking about here. Bec started the topic because she cannot afford to buy a similar flat that one of her aquaintances has been given as social housing. Her and my point is that surely that is not a fair situation and what is the incentive to work hard? Nora Batty has also backed up this theory with the persoanl example of her nephew yet you still rant on about the government spending money to convince us all that there is fraud going on?! That is one conspiracy theory too many I'm afraid.
Originally posted by shunt
It's £84 a fortnight and the other benefits you mention are rarely available and only available whilst at £84 a fortnight and then only if there are children. Any in increase one might add is deducted from the whole, hence, however hard you work, it's always £42 per week. It's hard to escape this system, since the only way to do so is fraud and the vast majority are either not criminal or not clever or able enough to do it. If they were, they wouldn't be there in the first place. More is spent on convincing you that there is widespread fraud than is taken by fraudsters. Housing is only provided to those genuinely on the street or to protect children and then usually after a long delay. My son was born in a hostel, whilst I was left to live rough, forbidden to be with my wife after 10.30pm, despite her impending labour. I was desperately trying to hold down a job, appear smart and clean, hiding my true sitution from my employers. I may be affluent now, but I never forget where I came from and one thing I'm sure of is that so called "scroungers" are a scapegoat.
Reply ID 41466
quote:It depends how far back you go. My father was considered an extravagant nutter for spending £7,500 on a 4 bed detached in 1/4 acre when his income was £3,500 p.a. That was before the credit boom of the 80's. In modern terms it would be like buying a £120,000 property on an income of £50,000. I doubt if someone doing that would be considered to be living beyond their means now.
Originally posted by Leaky
I don't really understand what the problem is here. I lived in Enfield for all of my childhood and when the time came to buy my own place I knew damn well that I couldn't afford anything in any of the parts of Enfield that I would want to live. Therefore my only affordable option was a studio flat in Cheshunt which was a pain when it came to seeing family and friends but was a good start on the 'property ladder'. I didn't feel put out that I couldn't afford to live on my own in my place of birth, it was just one of those things. It was only when I met Mrs Leaky that we pooled our funds and could afford a place in Hertford (which was always my place of choice). Even now with two full time incomes we 'only' have a two bedroom cottage so feeling some sort of natural right to start out with a two bedroom house seems a touch ambitious to me.
Reply ID 41467
quote:If compared like for like is that true? How many single people with a job, able to private rent and no children are provided with social housing? Though I sympathise with bec's problem, it is not caused by "scroungers". It hasn't changed much either, since the days of my "Oliver Twist" story. I am currently coaching someone with mental health issues through the same nightmare, who, without an advocate would be sleeping on Hartham and indeed was.
Originally posted by maggiequote:Shunt - whilst the story of your Oliver Twist like backgound is endearing, that is not what we are talking about here. Bec started the topic because she cannot afford to buy a similar flat that one of her aquaintances has been given as social housing. Her and my point is that surely that is not a fair situation and what is the incentive to work hard? Nora Batty has also backed up this theory with the personal example of her nephew yet you still rant on about the government spending money to convince us all that there is fraud going on?! That is one conspiracy theory too many I'm afraid.
Originally posted by shunt
It's £84 a fortnight and the other benefits you mention are rarely available and only available whilst at £84 a fortnight and then only if there are children. Any in increase one might add is deducted from the whole, hence, however hard you work, it's always £42 per week. It's hard to escape this system, since the only way to do so is fraud and the vast majority are either not criminal or not clever or able enough to do it. If they were, they wouldn't be there in the first place. More is spent on convincing you that there is widespread fraud than is taken by fraudsters. Housing is only provided to those genuinely on the street or to protect children and then usually after a long delay. My son was born in a hostel, whilst I was left to live rough, forbidden to be with my wife after 10.30pm, despite her impending labour. I was desperately trying to hold down a job, appear smart and clean, hiding my true sitution from my employers. I may be affluent now, but I never forget where I came from and one thing I'm sure of is that so called "scroungers" are a scapegoat.
Reply ID 41468
quote:Shunt has summed it up Bec. You might as well stop working hard and paying taxes and just have a kid. That's the way to get on the housing ladder under this government.
Originally posted by shunt
If compared like for like is that true? How many single people with a job, able to private rent and no children are provided with social housing? Though I sympathise with bec's problem, it is not caused by "scroungers". It hasn't changed much either, since the days of my "Oliver Twist" story. I am currently coaching someone with mental health issues through the same nightmare, who, without an advocate would be sleeping on Hartham and indeed was.
Reply ID 41469
quote:How's that then? Being socially housed and reliant on benefit is not "on the housing ladder". House ownership is an aspirational luxury and always has been, here and throughout the world. becs is closer to achieving it than anyone on benefits is. Yes, there is the occasional abuse. What do you suggest, that we leave babies on the street unless the parent can prove accidental pregnancy? Maybe you'd advocate the compulsory sterilisation of anyone without a job, or below a certain IQ, or who is unwell? How would that make any difference to property prices?
Originally posted by maggiequote:Shunt has summed it up Bec. You might as well stop working hard and paying taxes and just have a kid. That's the way to get on the housing ladder under this government.
Originally posted by shunt
If compared like for like is that true? How many single people with a job, able to private rent and no children are provided with social housing? Though I sympathise with bec's problem, it is not caused by "scroungers". It hasn't changed much either, since the days of my "Oliver Twist" story. I am currently coaching someone with mental health issues through the same nightmare, who, without an advocate would be sleeping on Hartham and indeed was.
Reply ID 41472
quote:Thats an interesting point - it should be noted that on average people are currently spending less of their monthly take home pay on their house/mortgage than they were in the early 90's. Stats like that are often used in the argument against an imminent crash.
It depends how far back you go. My father was considered an extravagant nutter for spending £7,500 on a 4 bed detached in 1/4 acre when his income was £3,500 p.a. That was before the credit boom of the 80's. In modern terms it would be like buying a £120,000 property on an income of £50,000. I doubt if someone doing that would be considered to be living beyond their means now.
Reply ID 41474
Shunt .. you may be onto something there!! Also folks, the ever popular 'buy to let' market has also been very damaging to house prices. I'm a firm believer that people who buy more than one property should be taxed 20% more on each of the properties that they own.
Reply ID 41476
I'm not sure that there's ever been a time when a 23 year old singleton has been able to go out and buy a two bed property in the location of choice just like that. Hasn't it always been the case that houses/homes were either bought by couples moving in together, or richer single people earning the big money in the city, or those who inherited or were lucky? Otherwise, it's a case of compromising and buying a flat, or apartment, perhaps in Hatfield, or on a shared ownership scheme, just until you're earning enough to get a bigger place, or until you marry and get two incomes to buy a better place. I don't think anything's changed except the willingness of the banks to lend us money.
Reply ID 41477
I believe that these figs are taken as % of repayments vs salary/income it is secured on. Now days it is often a joint salary where as previously it was just a single salary. So stats are still correct but have different implications this time around
Reply ID 41480
quote:Don't social housing tenants have a 'right to buy'? I really don't know, it's a genuine question, but I thought you could qualify to buy your rented home in some circumstances? In which case being socially housed could be a step on the housing ladder? Please correct me if I'm wrong. [?] I accept that many people struggle to survive on benefits. I also think we all know someone, as Nora does, who seems to manage well on benefits. Another Hertford example in the public domain would be the gentleman featured in the Mercury a year or two back, who won the Xmas Lights competition one year; he was quoted as having paid for the hundreds of pounds worth of lights 'by saving up his benefits'. (I'm sure we all also know someone who fiddles their tax, but somehow we don't seem to mind that so much as 'benefit scroungers', even though it costs us much more.) [:)]
Originally posted by shunt Being socially housed and reliant on benefit is not "on the housing ladder". House ownership is an aspirational luxury and always has been, here and throughout the world. becs is closer to achieving it than anyone on benefits is.
Reply ID 41482
There was a time when a 23 year old could buy a property.My partner purchased his first property at 22. It was a 2 bed flat and cost £23,995. His salary at the time was £7000. That was in 1985. If we were a young couple just about to embark on a life together (instead of being a pair of old codgers) we certainly couldn't afford to buy a property on our current combined income.
Reply ID 41484
My wife bought her first property in 1992 - it was a studio flat which cost £40K and she must have been earning about £11-12K at the time. When we'd got together and realised that there really wasn't enough room for the pair of us, she sold it in 1993 and made an £8K loss as that was when property prices were actually going DOWN!
Reply ID 41486
Before this goes too far, Bec, I hope that if you do have to purchase elsewhere to make a start, you will return to us, able to buy your house. If you are intelligent, healthy and capable, there are ways to make it happen, though they can be extreme in the effort required. I cleaned offices from 6-8am, worked in an office 9-5, then cleaned again until midnight. On Saturdays, I worked in a shop. You can't do it for long, but it gets your income up long enough to apply for a mortgage. Actually Rachel, benefit fraud is a drop in the ocean compared to what tax evasion costs us. The "right to buy" was introduced in the eighties, under the previous government and is largely responsible for the current prices and the assumption that to buy is a "right". You can't buy if you are on benefit, but if you can pull yourself out of that, you may in certain circumstances. Few of those buyers ever earn enough to pay private rent, so it gets them off the books, when otherwise they'd be always a burden. I doubt the young man, who I mentioned earlier, will ever achieve even that, but if the taxes I pay at least prevent him from dying, cold and alone and out in the open, I consider it money well spent.
Reply ID 41488
Your situation obviously put fire in your belly, Shunt, and as you say, you've never forgotten the experience and that is what has driven you. There's no fire in the belly of my nephew nor, I suspect, in the bellies of many of the people who live well on benefit. As my nephew's parents also live on benefit and have recently had to be rehoused in a 4 bedroom (detached) home due to their still-expanding family, it seems to me that with each generation that comes through this system the stigma of living on benefit becomes less and less and so does the desire to get off it.
Reply ID 41489
quote:That's a thought. However, it would just be passed onto the tenant with increaed rent.
Originally posted by azzza
Shunt .. you may be onto something there!! Also folks, the ever popular 'buy to let' market has also been very damaging to house prices. I'm a firm believer that people who buy more than one property should be taxed 20% more on each of the properties that they own.
Reply ID 41490
quote:Yeah, you're right on that one, but I consider myself to be lucky to be clever, well educated and fit. Even so, thanks to repeated redundancy, even I nearly went under. I'm aware that there are people who just lack the drive to get up off their a**e, but there are others who just fall through the net because they don't understand the system well enough to even get what they are entitled to. I guess it will never be perfect.
Originally posted by nora batty
Your situation obviously put fire in your belly, Shunt, and as you say, you've never forgotten the experience and that is what has driven you.
Reply ID 41494
Why has this topic ended up revolving around you and your hard luck stories Shunt? 3 jobs just to make ends meet; left out on the street; made redundant many times. Charles Dickens would have struggled to invent your life...
Reply ID 41495
quote:5,4,3,2,1....
Originally posted by maggie
Why has this topic ended up revolving around you and your hard luck stories Shunt? 3 jobs just to make ends meet; left out on the street; made redundant many times. Charles Dickens would have struggled to invent your life...
Reply ID 41497
quote:Curious that you see it that way. I think I've been lucky.
Originally posted by maggie
Why has this topic ended up revolving around you and your hard luck stories Shunt? 3 jobs just to make ends meet; left out on the street; made redundant many times. Charles Dickens would have struggled to invent your life...
Reply ID 41502
Ok I have a few points I would like to make: Firstly may I just say that I am overwhelmed by the response that my post has received, thank you to everyone whos written words of support and understanding. Secondly, to clarify my situation I am a sales negotiator for an estate agents in Barnet this, therefore, not only gives me an insite into the property market but I also consider it to be a resonably respectful career for someone my age and in terms of being able to get me a mortgage. Thirdly, I am only able to afford the property I am buying as I am lucky enough to have a fianceé who is also earning a fair income but even with both of our salaries we still can not afford choice. This I feel is a fundamental right when it comes to buying a home not just a property. Fourthly, the 'riverside properties' to which I refereed where indeed part of the 'Riviera development' and are being marketed at around £250k. Finally I would just like to re-affirm my point about 'spongers' - I do not consider a person or young family who are in need of a home to be taking advantage of the system it is the people who have children with others who they do not intend to stay with, do nothing to enhance their careers (working in the same shop for 8yrs with out going for any promotion or voluntary training for example) and generally wait for all aspects of life to be handed to them on a big, shiny, silver platter. These people are the really thorns in the side of the honest hard working citizen and yet in a few years time I am sure that all those currently living ‘beside the river’ will be given to chance to buy that property at a severely reduced price – PERFECT!
Reply ID 41503
quote:WTF?! do me a favour… Work harder and you might have a portfolio yourself one day. Don’t envy those who have achieved it through shrewd investment/luck/inheritance… Envy tax pisses me off no end. Fancy the same car/house/income as everyone else, comrade?
Originally posted by azzza
Shunt .. you may be onto something there!! Also folks, the ever popular 'buy to let' market has also been very damaging to house prices. I'm a firm believer that people who buy more than one property should be taxed 20% more on each of the properties that they own.
Reply ID 41506
quote:I can hear everyone sucking air in sharply and thinking "there goes the sympathy vote" [:D]
Originally posted by bec501uk
Secondly to clarify my situation I am a sales negotiator for an estate agents
Reply ID 41507
quote:Oh HaHa! [:D] In fact the reason I chose to work in property was in the hopes that the knowledge I gained would help me when it came to buying somewhere. I figured that the more clued up I was the better chance I had of getting what I needed.
Originally posted by JohnSmithquote:I can hear everyone sucking air in sharply and thinking "there goes the sympathy vote" [:D]
Originally posted by bec501uk
Secondly to clarify my situation I am a sales negotiator for an estate agents
Reply ID 41509
quote:Oh YES, sir. You hit the nail on the head and have posted that viewpoint before me. Second homes that sit empty for most of the year are not vital, nor are buy-to-lets. Tax second homes with bigger stamp duty and higher rates. How about an non council tax related occupancy tax (Mr Brown will soon hear of that potential stealth tax...). Buy-to-lets should be rated as a commercial property and have all relative costs applied. As for having a second property as an investment policy for when you retire/pension etc... if I carry on with this sentence I'll get myself into trouble! It would be interesting to see how prices fall when all the second properties are freed up for others to buy and actually live in!
Originally posted by azzza
Shunt .. you may be onto something there!! Also folks, the ever popular 'buy to let' market has also been very damaging to house prices. I'm a firm believer that people who buy more than one property should be taxed 20% more on each of the properties that they own.
Reply ID 41511
Check out this site for discussion re BTL, property prices, interest rates etc etc. Makes for interesting reading: http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/
Reply ID 41513
Does anyone think a recession is on it's way?
Reply ID 41515
quote:Good question .... I think there is a 'slow-up' but a full-on recession like the late 80's?... only time will tell. I think the BOE has learnt from past mistakes and is trying to slow the economy before it gets totally out of hand. It's a bit like waiting for a hurricane, either it will hit us head-on, or will fizzle out before it gets to land. Either way, batton down the hatches!
Originally posted by James007
Does anyone think a recession is on it's way?
Reply ID 41521
if there is, it's likely to be an external influence that causes it, i.e. a massive terrorist attack, or unexpected severe climate change. I remember before 911 rates were about where they are now, then 911 happened and they fell through the floor. A similar event could cause just a drastic a change (up or down!)
Reply ID 41522
quote:Difficult one this. Many of us have been forced to adapt our socialist (with a small 's')ideals, since we now live in this monetarist society and not the one we expected and prepared for. Faced with not "dying before we got old", a reduced likelyhood of state pension and nothing to leave to our chidren, second properties are, for some, their only way left of not becoming a burden on the generation that follows. Speaking for myself, it goes against my own principles, but I have little alternative. There are no tax breaks, like there would have been for a pension, but for many of us who lived through the 80's recession, there is not time left to invest in schemes which offer such breaks.
Originally posted by Mr Pquote:Oh YES, sir. You hit the nail on the head and have posted that viewpoint before me. Second homes that sit empty for most of the year are not vital, nor are buy-to-lets. Tax second homes with bigger stamp duty and higher rates. How about an non council tax related occupancy tax (Mr Brown will soon hear of that potential stealth tax...). Buy-to-lets should be rated as a commercial property and have all relative costs applied. As for having a second property as an investment policy for when you retire/pension etc... if I carry on with this sentence I'll get myself into trouble! It would be interesting to see how prices fall when all the second properties are freed up for others to buy and actually live in!
Originally posted by azzza
Shunt .. you may be onto something there!! Also folks, the ever popular 'buy to let' market has also been very damaging to house prices. I'm a firm believer that people who buy more than one property should be taxed 20% more on each of the properties that they own.
Reply ID 41529
Buy To Lets are a good investment in times of rising property prices and low interest rates (e.g. if you bought one over 5 years ago - well done). If, however, one has been bought recently with the likelyhood of of interest rates on the up and prices on the down it could possibly be the worst investment ever. The chances are that with such escalated prices at the moment the rental lincome would not cover the mortgage. That together with potential loss of value make them a no no. When, as is already beginning to happen, BTL owners start to feel the pinch then a glut of such properties will hit the market forcing prices down further and potentially causing the dreaded 'C' word (Crash!).
Reply ID 41531
I'd say anyone expecting a return from property investmant of less than 15 years is taking a risk. The trick is to buy during a crash and if you already own a property hang on to it and ride it through.
Reply ID 41533
"Buying when the numbers don’t add up may get you on the ladder but it won’t bring you freedom and it certainly won’t make you rich. Instead it will bring slavery in the form of huge debt repayment, payable every month for 25 years. I’m not anti buying houses. I’m just against buying them automatically because ‘you know where you are with bricks and mortar.’ You see, you don’t know where you are with bricks and mortar: buy at the right time and a house can bring you freedom, buy at the wrong time and it will only bring you slavery." Merryn Somerset Webb - Moneyweek That just about sums it up I think. Bec - don't bother buying now even if you can afford it - it could ruin your life!
Reply ID 41534
It looks as if the political debate is finally beginning to open up: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6750917.stm
Reply ID 41535
maggie's spot on. We are virtually the ony nation with this obsession with owning the property we live in. In Europe it's much more the norm to rent. Owning property there is a business activity, not part of family life. Even big speculators here are turning to rent to rent, in other words renting a block and then subletting, to minimise their exposure.
Reply ID 41538
Interstingly in the past year or so owners of some big houses have sold them and rented. Quite a gamble when playing with the roof over your head. After 9/11 interest rates were lowered as half of the financial district was closed. Also the biggest liquidity provider in the US Treasury market was all but destroyed thus distorting US mortgage rates (as there is a direct link between them).
Reply ID 41550
After reading all the posts since yesterday I have now come to the conclusion Bec that you and I should be a luxury camper van and have a home and transportation in one fowl swoop! In fact I believe becoming a "Gypsy" might be the thing to do... after all I believe our Council thinks its so important for those in society who choose not to pay taxes, to use taxpayers money to have somewhere to live.. I don't have to bother with recycling, I leave my rubbish where I live and some other sap picks it up and hey... I get an all year round suntan.... I am off to study "how to become a gypsy for free"... [;)]
Reply ID 41565
quote:No..... I'm not going to get drawn into the gypsy debate again! Give us a break from all these sweeping pronouncements against other groups!
Originally posted by Drama Queen
After reading all the posts since yesterday I have now come to the conclusion Bec that you and I should be a luxury camper van and have a home and transportation in one fowl swoop! In fact I believe becoming a "Gypsy" might be the thing to do... after all I believe our Council thinks its so important for those in society who choose not to pay taxes, to use taxpayers money to have somewhere to live.. I don't have to bother with recycling, I leave my rubbish where I live and some other sap picks it up and hey... I get an all year round suntan.... I am off to study "how to become a gypsy for free"... [;)]
Reply ID 41566
quote:I was under the impression that send homes were already taxed. As in, when you sell it, you need to pay 40% tax on any profit made, due to it being an income and above the high-rate tax bracket when added to your normal income. And this is maybe a little off-topic, but is related to discussions earlier in teh thread. BUT, if there is no work out there for all these people who claim unemployment benefit, where have all the jobs for the Eastern Europeans come from? It's true what they say in that there are a certain percentage of unemployed people who know when they're on to a good thing, with cheap housing, benefits for this that and the other etc. There's also a pride factor, where people think they're better than being a cleaner, or a brickie, or working in a car wash. It's a job, and I know I would certainly rather be working than watching daytime TV.
Originally posted by Mr P
...Tax second homes with bigger stamp duty and higher rates.
Reply ID 41575
quote:There are also the unemployable. What I feel is wrong is that the system discourages and hampers the ability to find or start work, once you're within it. It's all about penalties and stigma, rather than encouragement and reward for progress. Many go in with horror, genuinely needing a tempory leg-up, but then find it hard to escape. Worst of all about this negative system is that the most needy don't know how to defend their entitlements and fall through the net. All we see is the canny ones who don't. In effect, the effort of maintaining benefits becomes a full time job and the work ethic is lost.
Originally posted by thefair1973quote:I was under the impression that send homes were already taxed. As in, when you sell it, you need to pay 40% tax on any profit made, due to it being an income and above the high-rate tax bracket when added to your normal income. And this is maybe a little off-topic, but is related to discussions earlier in teh thread. BUT, if there is no work out there for all these people who claim unemployment benefit, where have all the jobs for the Eastern Europeans come from? It's true what they say in that there are a certain percentage of unemployed people who know when they're on to a good thing, with cheap housing, benefits for this that and the other etc. There's also a pride factor, where people think they're better than being a cleaner, or a brickie, or working in a car wash. It's a job, and I know I would certainly rather be working than watching daytime TV.
Originally posted by Mr P
...Tax second homes with bigger stamp duty and higher rates.
Reply ID 41690
quote:The government doesn't pay for anything - it's OUR money!
Originally posted by nora batty
Since my nephew's teenage girlfriend produced a babby, they have moved into a flat in Toothbrush Towers. Neither of them work, yet they run a car and have all the latest baby gear. As far as I know, they havn't come by this dishonestly and both of them come from poor backgrounds. If the Government isn't paying for all this, I wonder who is?
Reply ID 41708
Well, the house has been sold in Bengeo Street for £499.99 (£500,000) for a semi, when will all end when nobody can aford to move - stalemate!
Reply ID 41886
quote:Problem is, if your flat it central London is worth £600k, moving to a semi in Bengeo at 500k seems easy.
Originally posted by furrybunny
Well, the house has been sold in Bengeo Street for £499.99 (£500,000) for a semi, when will all end when nobody can aford to move - stalemate!
Reply ID 41890
5 pages - Is there a solution?
Reply ID 41907
Interest rates at 7% would make the pips start squeaking. Would also mean that those with money in the bank would actually earn some worthwhile interest. Low interest rates are not a good thing for every member of society.
Reply ID 41908
quote:It would also screw over the people that have just managed to get a foot on the property ladder leading to reposessions and eventually a house price crash and recession. Then Gordon Brown could wash his hands of it and blame the Bank of England for messing up interest rates. Recession anybody?
Originally posted by carlos fandango
Interest rates at 7% would make the pips start squeaking. Would also mean that those with money in the bank would actually earn some worthwhile interest. Low interest rates are not a good thing for every member of society.
Reply ID 41913
Can't have it both ways. Someone has to suffer to bring the market back. Or the much argued against new developements such as harlow north have to be allowed.
Reply ID 41939
The Interest rates so low (remember when they were 15%??) mean nobody is saving, or has the incentive to... The housing market is way off kilter and somewhere along the line it will end.. But, after the recession in 1992 people picked themselves up again and this "boom and bust" will continue to happen unless a more realistic set up is created... What's the answer God knows, but it is not sustainable without people starting at the bottom of the ladder and if that dries up significantly we are all in trouble...
Reply ID 41992
Why cannot the government give tax relief on mortgages for the first time buyers for the first three years just to help them on their way? this was suggested in the media a few days ago.
Reply ID 41996
quote:The problem is, whichever way it is made easier to buy a property, whether by lower interest rates, increased income multipliers, or tax relief, the market will respond with higher prices.
Originally posted by furrybunny
Why cannot the government give tax relief on mortgages for the first time buyers for the first three years just to help them on their way? this was suggested in the media a few days ago.
Reply ID 41999
Hmm time for me to purchase that campervan and head off into the sunset!
Reply ID 42000
quote:Given recent weather, maybe an Ark and sail off in the general direction that sunset would have been, if it were not for a big black cloud obscuring it.
Originally posted by Drama Queen
Hmm time for me to purchase that campervan and head off into the sunset!
Reply ID 42001
Just an idea, It seems everybody is not a fan of estate agents (sorry agents), due to a number of different reasons. A few people now seem to advertise their own homes on the internet. How about this website having a section for house sellers and buyers? Maybe the site could then make a little bit of cash on the side for development? And become a virtual estate agent!!!!! Thoughts?
Reply ID 42593
Useful Link: [url="http://politics.guardian.co.uk/economics/story/0,,2122703,00.html"]Mortgage shake-up to tackle homes crisis[/url]
Reply ID 42595
The trouble is...would you sign up for a 25 year fix with penalties for early redemption?
Reply ID 42651
quote:Great idea! Particularly as I can have a nose in other peoples houses!
Originally posted by teddylad
Just an idea, It seems everybody is not a fan of estate agents (sorry agents), due to a number of different reasons. A few people now seem to advertise their own homes on the internet. How about this website having a section for house sellers and buyers? Maybe the site could then make a little bit of cash on the side for development? And become a virtual estate agent!!!!! Thoughts?
Reply ID 44797
Living in my one-bed flat in Bengeo that I bought nearly 5 years ago, always slightly cramped and now increasingly so, despite constant, almost obsessional, de-cluttering, I am considering moving to somewhere slightly more spacious. Making regular overpayments on my flexible mortgage has softened the recent interest rate rises, and reduced my capital, but I really would like to move to somewhere with a bit more room. I have viewed a few places locally, ranging from £200k - £230k for 2-bedroom flats. Now, looking further afield, I could get somewhere slightly cheaper and more spacious, but I would really prefer to stay in Hertford. My job is here, my friends are here, and I really do not want to be forced out of Hertford for the sake of upsizing. If I thought house prices were going to crash, I would sell-to-rent but I really don't think they will, despite the recent slowdown. As a single person, it's not that easy to afford housing in this town, but it's a very nice town and I will do my darndest to stay here, but if I have to say goodbye at some point just so I can have a separate living room then so be it! Northern Rock were the only bank to offer to lend me X times my salary to buy my flat in Bengeo - I thought they were nuts at the time, but accepted the offer through naivety, excitement and overconfidence. I have, however, been lucky. If I knew then what I knew now, I'd never have etc etc but isn't hindsight wonderful!?
Reply ID 44998
I called the estate agents late on Friday afternoon about a 2-bed house in Hertford that has recently gone on the market - the response was "You have to view it this weekend and we need a decision by Monday". I'm not sure if properties in Hertford really are still going like hot-cakes, or if this was just the hard sell. I'm going to call again later today to see if it has actually been sold. I went to the property last night and the board still read: "For sale" so I'm not sure if an offer has been accepted over the weekend, but I was surprised at the speed with which these properties are selling if what they said was true. The affordability of a 2-bed house over a 1-bed flat increases on the basis that you can rent-a-room and, as opposed to flats, there is no monthly maintenance charge. Note to admin: this is relevant to Hertford, because the house prices in Hertford seem higher than less-desirable surrounding towns, yet despite that many of us want to stay (even forsaking our privacy for the privilege) but, sadly, some of us are priced out.
Reply ID 44999
quote:I think it depends on the house and curcumstance. A house on the road I live on was on the market for months before attractingt an offer. Unfortunately the buyer withdrew the offer but when it went back on the market it had an offer in about a week.
Originally posted by SallyB
I called the estate agents late on Friday afternoon about a 2-bed house in Hertford that has recently gone on the market - the response was "You have to view it this weekend and we need a decision by Monday". I'm not sure if properties in Hertford really are still going like hot-cakes, or if this was just the hard sell. I'm going to call again later today to see if it has actually been sold. I went to the property last night and the board still read: "For sale" so I'm not sure if an offer has been accepted over the weekend, but I was surprised at the speed with which these properties are selling if what they said was true. The affordability of a 2-bed house over a 1-bed flat increases on the basis that you can rent-a-room and, as opposed to flats, there is no monthly maintenance charge. Note to admin: this is relevant to Hertford, because the house prices in Hertford seem higher than less-desirable surrounding towns, yet despite that many of us want to stay (even forsaking our privacy for the privilege) but, sadly, some of us are priced out.
Reply ID 45002
Yes, I called them and they said the house will be sold to the person with the highest offer at 5 pm today.
Reply ID 45003
So it's a blind auction then
Reply ID 45004
It wasn't a house in Byde Street was it? It seems stupid to me that properties should be sold to a highest bidder. We were priced out of 2 houses through that, one in Parkhurst Rd and the other in a road just off Port Vale. It's so annoying. It seems most houses now that are worth over the 250k threshold are put up for 250 knowing that people will be interested and then sell through a bidding war. House purchasing has gone mad!
Reply ID 45006
This area is the victim of low supply and high demand, thus the 'Open Day - Highest Bid' scenario. Estate agents know that they can cause a hiatus and inflated price by using this method (however, some agents do not actually call them 'open-days' now due to the bad name!). Don't blame the Agents, they are only getting the best price for the seller,.. it's the mad panic buyers that you have to question.
Reply ID 45007
The agents said that somebody has already offered the asking price, but that the sellers wanted to wait until 5 pm today to see if they got any higher offers, before agreeing a sale. This is just what I was told - I don't actually know what goes on behind the scenes. Steve, I don't know if one would refer to it as a blind auction - for all I know, they might have curtains... Bubbaoshea, it wasn't on Byde Street, no.
Reply ID 45248
quote:Itys one of the oldest tricks in the book. The best advice I could give is....pick your price, and stick to it. If you get it, great. If you don't, then it wasn't for you. The quicker the gov tackle the agents the better. The market is over run with cowboys.
Originally posted by SallyB
The agents said that somebody has already offered the asking price, but that the sellers wanted to wait until 5 pm today to see if they got any higher offers, before agreeing a sale. This is just what I was told - I don't actually know what goes on behind the scenes. Steve, I don't know if one would refer to it as a blind auction - for all I know, they might have curtains... Bubbaoshea, it wasn't on Byde Street, no.