Topic ID 5251
I know I'm going to sound like a old moan ... BUT As the good weather seems to be with us, could I respectfully ask cyclists NOT to cycle on the footpath. This morning, when walking with my 2 year old, we narrowly avoided being hit by three separate cyclist riding through the subway (a footpath) under London Road, near the fire station. I know the roads are busy, but hurtling through at full pelt could seriously injure someone. I have reported the Royal Mail cyclists with minimal impact, as they race out by Abel Smith school, and would just ask that particularly in the subways where you can't see who is coming around the corner, can cyclists either dismount or ride standing on one pedal so you can get off quickly. Thanks - I do speak as a mum, pedestrian and a cyclist!
Reply ID 73913
So it's not the cycling on pavements that is the problem, it's the style of cycling, ie "at full pelt". Would you have the same issue if the cyclist passed you slowly and considerately?
Reply ID 73914
I understand your point Steve. Sadly, I accept that people will cycle on the pavement. I don't like it, but if I'd said don't cycle on the pavement, I anticipate people would have said the roads are too busy. My concern is the safety of pedestrians, be it toddlers or those less able to move out the way quickly. If people insist on cycling on the pavement, I would ask that they are more mindful of those on foot. In my experience, there are significant blind spots in the subway which worry me if people cycle through them at speed. I hope that clarifies the reasoning for my post.
Reply ID 73916
quote:Agreed - some lycra clad w***ker nearly sent me flying on Fore St yesterday as he hammered up the pavement outside Ask
Originally posted by Steve
So it's not the cycling on pavements that is the problem, it's the style of cycling, ie "at full pelt". Would you have the same issue if the cyclist passed you slowly and considerately?
Reply ID 73920
quote:As a cyclist and pedestrian I completely agree. I confess to occasionally cycling through underpasses myself but always do so with due consideration to pedestrians, which includes stopping if children are passing and ringing my bell when approaching blind corners. Sadly there are wreckless people in all walks of life (no pun intended).
Originally posted by SMT
My concern is the safety of pedestrians, be it toddlers or those less able to move out the way quickly. If people insist on cycling on the pavement, I would ask that they are more mindful of those on foot. In my experience, there are significant blind spots in the subway which worry me if people cycle through them at speed. I hope that clarifies the reasoning for my post.
Reply ID 73921
quote:As a cyclist and pedestrian I completely agree. I confess to occasionally cycling through underpasses myself but always do so with due consideration to pedestrians, which includes stopping if children are passing and ringing my bell when approaching blind corners. Sadly there are wreckless people in all walks of life (no pun intended). [/quote "wreckless"? Steve.....tut tut!
Originally posted by Steve
[quote]Originally posted by SMT
My concern is the safety of pedestrians, be it toddlers or those less able to move out the way quickly. If people insist on cycling on the pavement, I would ask that they are more mindful of those on foot. In my experience, there are significant blind spots in the subway which worry me if people cycle through them at speed. I hope that clarifies the reasoning for my post.
Reply ID 73923
quote:This is all I ask for. My 2 year old daughter often walks through the underpass, as it is a safe place, away from cars. While I accept it is my responsibility to ensure her safety, she could be seriously injured if hit by a cyclist travelling a full speed. She will stop if I shout out to her, but she wouldn't know to move to the side, and can't get out of the way it the cyclist is going fast. I would just thank people for their consideration if they do cycle through the underpasses.
Originally posted by Steve but always do so with due consideration to pedestrians, which includes stopping if children are passing and ringing my bell when approaching blind corners.
Reply ID 73927
Cycling on pavements is actually illegal:- Q. Is cycling on the pavement against the law? A. Yes. Cycling on the footway (pavement) is an offence under Section 72 ofthe Highways Act 1835 as amended by Section 85 (1) of the Local GovernmentAct 1888. Q. Who is responsible for enforcing the laws and what are thepenalties for breaking the laws? A. The enforcement of cycling offences is an operational matter for localpolice forces. The police use the Fixed Penalty Notice (FPN) of£30, which provides them with a direct means of dealing with mostminor offences. The Road Traffic Act 1991 makes the two most serious cycling offences parallel to those of dangerous and careless driving. The maximum fines are currently £2,500 for dangerous cycling and£1,000 for careless cycling. You could always try calling the police and reporting this to them - not that they will do anything about it
Reply ID 73928
quote:Hertfordshire police can carry out 'proactive operations across the county to stop speeding drivers' as in the the link below. http://www.hertfordshiremercury.co.uk/Hertfordshire/Police-crack-down-on-speeding-motorists.htm So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists? It would only take a warning that they will be fined next time they are caught to have an impact.
Originally posted by Kitty Kat
Cycling on pavements is actually illegal:- Q. Is cycling on the pavement against the law? A. Yes. Cycling on the footway (pavement) is an offence under Section 72 ofthe Highways Act 1835 as amended by Section 85 (1) of the Local GovernmentAct 1888. Q. Who is responsible for enforcing the laws and what are thepenalties for breaking the laws? A. The enforcement of cycling offences is an operational matter for localpolice forces. The police use the Fixed Penalty Notice (FPN) of£30, which provides them with a direct means of dealing with mostminor offences. The Road Traffic Act 1991 makes the two most serious cycling offences parallel to those of dangerous and careless driving. The maximum fines are currently £2,500 for dangerous cycling and£1,000 for careless cycling. You could always try calling the police and reporting this to them - not that they will do anything about it
Reply ID 73929
Good idea. Also, can they please fine the man that rides home each day in his black and red lycra outfit - my daughter is in fits every time we pass him, as you can clearly see straight through the seat of his shorts [:D]
Reply ID 73931
quote:I guess because the majority would prefer that their time was better allocated to preventing or solving real crimes.
Originally posted by Ewoowar So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists? It would only take a warning that they will be fined next time they are caught to have an impact.
Reply ID 73934
quote:A CPSO walking round the town for an hour or a CPSO in the underpass stopping what is anti-social behaviour.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:I guess because the majority would prefer that their time was better allocated to preventing or solving real crimes.
Originally posted by Ewoowar So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists? It would only take a warning that they will be fined next time they are caught to have an impact.
Reply ID 73936
My mother was knocked down by a cyclist in February (although in London) and was rushed to hospital with critical injuries including brain injuries and 3 fractures in her facial bones. We do not know the full details as she was knocked unconscious and the cyclist did not stop. We can only assume the failure to stop is indicative of some guilt but we do not know that. The local police took it very seriously and scoured CCTV but nothing has happened as of now. 2 months later she is nearly medically healed, the fractures are healing and she is home but she is struggling to regain normality and is starting to get clinically depressed. Speeding cyclists, as described in posts above, can be extremely dangerous and not fair on the majority of cyclists who do it responsibly.
Reply ID 73937
quote:Thats not exactly what you said though is it. This is "So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists?" I thought that the CPSO's already walked around town doing exactly that? Im not trying to be confrontational, its just my view that placing Policemen/women or CPSO's in one place for an hour or so is a waste of resources.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:A CPSO walking round the town for an hour or a CPSO in the underpass stopping what is anti-social behaviour.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:I guess because the majority would prefer that their time was better allocated to preventing or solving real crimes.
Originally posted by Ewoowar So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists? It would only take a warning that they will be fined next time they are caught to have an impact.
Reply ID 73938
quote:So if someone like SMT knew when cyclists are most likely to go through the underpass (morning or afternoon as part of the rush hour perhaps?) then placing someone there to stop and warn them is a waste of time? By that logic placing police or CPSOs anywhere proactively to stop crime or anti-social behaviour is too.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:Thats not exactly what you said though is it. This is "So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists?" I thought that the CPSO's already walked around town doing exactly that? Im not trying to be confrontational, its just my view that placing Policemen/women or CPSO's in one place for an hour or so is a waste of resources.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:A CPSO walking round the town for an hour or a CPSO in the underpass stopping what is anti-social behaviour.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:I guess because the majority would prefer that their time was better allocated to preventing or solving real crimes.
Originally posted by Ewoowar So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists? It would only take a warning that they will be fined next time they are caught to have an impact.
Reply ID 73940
quote:In my opionion having someone waiting in an underpass for an hour or so to catch cyclists who have not dismounted to issue a warning is a complete and utter waste of time, money and resources. If it really is an on-going issue and several complaints have been received and a 10-20 minute time window can be put on the "offence" then maybe in my view it could be justified.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:So if someone like SMT knew when cyclists are most likely to go through the underpass (morning or afternoon as part of the rush hour perhaps?) then placing someone there to stop and warn them is a waste of time? By that logic placing police or CPSOs anywhere proactively to stop crime or anti-social behaviour is too.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:Thats not exactly what you said though is it. This is "So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists?" I thought that the CPSO's already walked around town doing exactly that? Im not trying to be confrontational, its just my view that placing Policemen/women or CPSO's in one place for an hour or so is a waste of resources.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:A CPSO walking round the town for an hour or a CPSO in the underpass stopping what is anti-social behaviour.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:I guess because the majority would prefer that their time was better allocated to preventing or solving real crimes.
Originally posted by Ewoowar So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists? It would only take a warning that they will be fined next time they are caught to have an impact.
Reply ID 73942
Perhaps the council should recognise what is happening with respect to bikes at the underpass near the Postal Depot and school (albeit that it is strictly illegal at the moment). The underpass is fairly wide, so why not revoke the ban on cycling and split the carriageway into a pedestrian and a cycling designated areas? The underpass in Castle Street could retain the ban on cycling as there is a toucan crossing just a bit further down.
Reply ID 73943
quote:Glad you agree with me. Sounds like a plan. [:D]
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:In my opionion having someone waiting in an underpass for an hour or so to catch cyclists who have not dismounted to issue a warning is a complete and utter waste of time, money and resources. If it really is an on-going issue and several complaints have been received and a 10-20 minute time window can be put on the "offence" then maybe in my view it could be justified.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:So if someone like SMT knew when cyclists are most likely to go through the underpass (morning or afternoon as part of the rush hour perhaps?) then placing someone there to stop and warn them is a waste of time? By that logic placing police or CPSOs anywhere proactively to stop crime or anti-social behaviour is too.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:Thats not exactly what you said though is it. This is "So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists?" I thought that the CPSO's already walked around town doing exactly that? Im not trying to be confrontational, its just my view that placing Policemen/women or CPSO's in one place for an hour or so is a waste of resources.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:A CPSO walking round the town for an hour or a CPSO in the underpass stopping what is anti-social behaviour.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrewquote:I guess because the majority would prefer that their time was better allocated to preventing or solving real crimes.
Originally posted by Ewoowar So why not a policeman or two, or a CPSO, in the underpass for an hour in the morning to stop and warn cyclists? It would only take a warning that they will be fined next time they are caught to have an impact.
Reply ID 73945
quote:I have reported the matter to the Royal Mail, who have (in my own experience) been the main culprits and hope it improves. However, with sunshine, I suspect more of us will take to our bikes. If it continues, I intend to ask a CSPO to include a walk of the underpass on their rounds, or contact the Town Council to try and highlight the problem. I have noticed a particular problem between 7.30am-8.00am and around 6pm, but that's just me. The Royal Mail said that they have received very few complaints of this nature, but I had experienced it 3 times in less than a week.
Originally posted by Kitty Kat [You could always try calling the police and reporting this to them - not that they will do anything about it
Reply ID 73947
I also seek bike posties cycling the wrong way up Fore Street.
Reply ID 73950
quote:Yeap, I mentioned that in my email yesterday. Can I ask that if you do also feel it is an issue that you contact them via the Royal Mail website; I feel a got a bit of a brush off because no-one else had mentioned it.
Originally posted by Steve
I also seek bike posties cycling the wrong way up Fore Street.
Reply ID 73953
The introduction of cycle paths/routes in and around Hertford would be useful but the existing road and path widths would make this highly unlikely. Maybe if cyclists used a bicycle bell shortly before they wizz past after their (usually) silent approach, we wouldn't be quite so startled. Although not legally correct, I do understand why cyclists would prefer to ride on the path.
Reply ID 73954
I think one of the problems here is with the Post Office location. To access the roads they would have to go to one of the roundabouts via a torturous route and its much easier to go via the subway. As a cyclist and pedestrian who lives nearby I also use a bit of the pavement to access the town for the same reasons - although not the subway as I consider the OP right in deeming this dangerous. I think if someone reminded the Post Office of the implications if one of their employees hit a pedestrian they may re-think the instructions given to their employees.
Reply ID 73955
This afternoon I was forced the cycle on the pavement between Tamworth Road and Cromwell Road because a woman was walking her dogs in the cycle lane [:p]
Reply ID 73971
quote:I have!! And apparently it's not a problem. All the staff have been told not to do it; I agree the worst point is the corner of Abel Smith playing ground, and despite my complaint I was nearly taken out there yesterday morning.
Originally posted by Golden
I think if someone reminded the Post Office of the implications if one of their employees hit a pedestrian they may re-think the instructions given to their employees.
Reply ID 73976
quote:Hmm.. ask them if they have heard of vicarious liability. Just telling staff that doing something dangerous or illegal isn’t enough, they should take measures to police/enforce their instruction. And if I got hit I'd sue Royal Mail not the postie. They have more money. Oh, & while you’re at it, ask to see the relevant risk assessment & the measures taken to alleviate this hazard (see they can be useful.. occasionally[:p])
Originally posted by SMTquote:I have!! And apparently it's not a problem. All the staff have been told not to do it; I agree the worst point is the corner of Abel Smith playing ground, and despite my complaint I was nearly taken out there yesterday morning.
Originally posted by Golden
I think if someone reminded the Post Office of the implications if one of their employees hit a pedestrian they may re-think the instructions given to their employees.
Reply ID 73977
Don't worry everyone, Royal Mail will soon be abandoning bikes and switching to vans, adding to congestion and parked up on pavements so we have to step into the road to get around them. http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/royal-mail-scrap-bicycles-for-safety-reasons-25576 And then once Royal Mail are able to centralise deliveries from a larger depot, Greencoates will be no more.
Reply ID 73978
quote:Their vans can be driven just as dangerously. There was one a few years ago that would regularly squeeze through the Port Vale barrier using the pavement/cycle lane.
Originally posted by james
Don't worry everyone, Royal Mail will soon be abandoning bikes and switching to vans, adding to congestion and parked up on pavements so we have to step into the road to get around them. http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/royal-mail-scrap-bicycles-for-safety-reasons-25576 And then once Royal Mail are able to centralise deliveries from a larger depot, Greencoates will be no more.
Reply ID 74005
quote:PCSO?
Originally posted by SMT I intend to ask a CSPO
Reply ID 74006
quote:That'll be it; I had incorrectly copied it from an earlier posting but I think everyone had got the general idea! At least all the correct letters were there! Community Support Police Officer Police Community Support Officer ...
Originally posted by stevenquote:PCSO?
Originally posted by SMT I intend to ask a CSPO
Reply ID 74655
My email correspondence with Royal Mail seems to be having minimal effect. They've refused to let me have a copy of the H&S risk assessment and after assuring me that all cyclists were told to comply with the Highway Code, I was nearly wiped out walking by Abel Smith the very next day!! I've asked for my complaint to be escalated and have advised I will contact the local Police. I wouldn't mind but I cycle around with my 2 year old on the back of my bike, and were necessary walk my bike and take a longer route to avoid the Tesco roundabout. That said a woman shouted at me telling me I was dangerous for cycling on the road..... as she walked across a crossing when the green light/Red man was on and my daughter was shouting "Green light go mummy"!!